Lula Gloyne Transcript Tape 4


Interview Lula Gloyne
05/13/1982 tape 4 of 4


Interviewer (Voice 1): …The housekeeping staff wears blue, though. (Laughs) The housekeeping staff wears blue. They are different, but I never thought about that.


Lula Gloyne: You go into the hospital and you see the doctors and nurses in white. And the graduate nurses in green. You know right away that they’re graduate nurses or that they’re nurses. And you see [audio cut] and you see the LPNs and you know them different from the maids, because maybe the maids will have blue and one will have stripes or green or something. It would make a big difference.


Interviewer: I think you’re right. Maybe people would take them more seriously.


L.G.: They would. They would. Because that doctor said that’s why they didn’t- He said  if they tried to wear it and look decent, I mean, wear white like they’re supposed to do, the lowest worker in the hospital would come in in white just like yours. You can’t tell the difference and it creates a bad feeling for the doctors, I think. Or did, I guess. I think it’s just been followed through on before the doctor leaves he tells the other doctor why they don’t wear white and they don’t try to clean up… [audio cut].


Interviewer: …And they just keep doing it. It seems like the people used to know the doctors a lot better than they do now.


L.G.: They did. And they would now if they wore white and were distinguished from other people.


Interviewer: [Agrees] Because everybody used to be able to talk about, like Dr. Holt. Everybody talks about him with a lot of respect and everything. And they really thought highly of him. But they don’t even seem to know who works up there now. Don’t know anything at all.


L.G.: I don’t know any of them. I know Dr. Trillian [sp?], that’s all. I don’t know any of the other doctors. And the nurses wear white, the graduate nurses. And they should wear their caps. They don’t do that anymore.


Interviewer: I guess you’re right. They don’t do that too much anymore.


L.G.: You got to do something like that to create, something to be noticed. And know. People know. They see you with the cap, they know you’re a graduate nurse. You’re in there with white on and no cap, they don’t wear caps half of them. LPNs can have a cap of their own whether they’re LPNs or whether they’re nurses. I think it would make a big difference.


Interviewer: It wouldn’t hurt trying it for a while. It would be worth a shot.


L.G.: When Mrs. [Pride?] was up there, she kept them on the ball. Real good.


Interviewer: Yeah I heard a story about one of them that was real strict about the way they dressed, right down to their shoe-laces being clean. I can’t remember if that was her or not. I don’t remember. I think you need that strong backbone.


L.G.: I know. They need to be distinguished. I mean, I feel it anyways. I don’t know whether anybody else does or not, but I can see. I know, you know. When you go into a general hospital, you know right away who’s your doctor and who isn’t. Bu they’re getting kind of careless too.


Interviewer: Yeah, they really are. But yeah, if you see that, then maybe people think that these aren’t real doctors down here.


L.G.: Right. They think they’re just interns.


Interviewer: [Agrees] They have so many students coming in and out of there, maybe they just… It’s hard to tell-


L.G.: -But that could create the respect, if they had… if they could be distinguished from the other people.


Interviewer: That’s a good point.


L.G.: I think it is too.


Interviewer: Yeah, that would be a good one, because that wouldn’t cost them anything and-


L.G.: -No, wouldn’t cost them a thing. And they don’t pay the respect to the doctors like they used to. It’s not the doctor you’re respecting, it’s the profession.


Interviewer: Oh yeah. The individual might not be good at all. Because so much of your illness is effected by how you think. If you believe somebody can help you, good chance is that they can.


L.G.: [Inaudible]... give out the medicine now a days?


Interviewer: [Hm] Do they?


L.G.: They did when I was there.


Interviewer: Isn't there some legal problem with that? [laughs]


L.G.: I don't know whether ... [inaudible] ... or not?


Interviewer: I know by law there's certain things that can't be done, that can be done.


L.G.: Do you know Ms. [Bird?]


Interviewer: No.


L.G.: She works up there. She's a doctor's aid, I think. She's good. She's good. She must be about ready to retire. She's been there a long time. I don't know anybody. I know Ms. Bird and I know Myrtle. I know [inaudible]. And I know some of the LPNs. I don't know many of them. I don't go up there anymore.


Interviewer: Stay healthy, that's your best bet. [Both speakers laugh] You do that and you'll be okay.


L.G.: I could give you some coffee or something?


Interviewer: Oh, that's okay. I enjoyed it. I appreciate you talking to me. I'd like to go back.


L.G.: You should, should come back. Come back and stay with me sometime.


Interviewer: [Laughs] Okay.


L.G.: I've got plenty of room. I stay alone. [ It's not often] somebody come and stays with me at night.


Interviewer: Yeah. I'll have to come down sometime. I enjoyed it. I could just listen forever. You should have written a book about your experiences.


L.G.: My funniest experience, I had a woman that was blind. Or she was just about blind  [inaudible] over here, Bethel. And [inaudible] on the hill. She used to live right at the bottom of the hill. And her husband worked for the school. And when he got to work for the school, they moved to the school and their house was just there. But before they moved to the school, they have just built a new [inaudible] house. They had an outhouse. They didn't have running water like they have now. Every house has running water into the toilets nowdays, but in those days there were outhouses. And we were coming down the hill from the cemetery and she said, "Oh! I've got to go to the toilet." And I said, "right here?" And she said, "Yes. We have a new toilet right down there. Right by my old house. We can stop there." And I looked up and I thought, Oh but there's this long line of people. And I said, "Can't you wait?" And she said, "No." And she took my by the hand and said, "come on now and take me to the toilet. They won't know which one of us has to go." [Laughter] So we went. I held on to as much dignity as I could with all those people going by. I led her in, and she stepped in. And I stepped in and went to pull the door shut. I couldn't budge it. It was wedged into the bank. And I said, "I can't shut this door." And she said, "Oh, I guess I'll just pee on myself." I said, "Don't pee on yourself." She said, "Just wait a minute. I'll shut it." Well, I stepped aside and they a box nailed up there with newspapers in it. But it hadn't been used in a long time and I put my hand up on the box just standing there holding on to the inside of the door. And I don't know why I did it but I did it. And she stepped out and jerked that door and said, "Now I shut it." And she shut the door and just and she stepped over, the whole house began to turn over. [Inaudible] ... but I was holding onto that box and she was leaning at the toilet and she said, "Oh Lula, Lula, Lula!" And I said, "Don't call on me. I done called on the Lord." [Laughter] When the house hit the ground the first time, the roof fell off. Well, it went on rolling down. And we just went bumpity bump. I don't know how she kept from falling over. She was hanging on, leaning down by the toilet seat and hanging on to that and screaming. And my feet were flopping, I hung onto the box. [Inaudible] and we rocked back and forth and quit. And she said, "Did anybody see us?" And I said, "Did anybody see us! All those people coming down the hill." I said, “I’m not coming out again until they go by.” And somebody looked down and said, "That little house has fallen over. There’s somebody in it. I know they’re killed.” He had a baby in his arms and he threw it way out in the grass, you know, and started running down the hill to us. Bout that time I said, “[inaudible], I’m going to look and see.” I stuck my head up and by that time he said, “Lord have mercy! There’s somebody in there and I know they’re killed.” He said, “I know they’re killed.” And he threw his baby and nearly killed it out in the weeds. And I stuck my head up and said, “Ha ha hahaha. Duck much?” They said, “That crazy Lula!” [Laughter]


Interviewer: How embarrassing!


L.G.: I wouldn’t come out. Some women came up and I said, “I’m not coming out of here until those people get gone.” And [inaudible] peed all over herself.


Interviewer: She finally got to go.


L.G.: Good thing I didn’t have to go. Oh, mighty! That was one of the funniest and most dangerous experiences I guess I’ve ever had. But just imagine being in a little house and having it roll down over and turned over…


Interviewer: The roof flies off.


L.G.: And she sat down and hung onto the toilet there. She hung on hard enough it didn’t throw her over. My feet went over and over like that and I was hanging onto the box.


Interviewer: Oh, that’d be awful.


L.G.: And my husband was still [inaudible] and I came home and I didn’t tell him word about it and Dr. [Minger?] came down and he checked all of us and to see if she was hurt. And Dr. Minger came down and said, “How’s your wrecker?” My husband said, “What do you mean?” He said, “Your wife. Didn’t you know she was a wrecker?” He said, “No. What’s a wrecker?” Dr. Minger told him about us falling over in the little house. He said, “She never said a word about anything.” He said, “When did it happen?” Dr. Minger said, “Yesterday.” Oh, he came around here and said, “Well, did you get hurt? Why didn’t you say something about it? Are you hurt?” And he stared at my legs were all bruised. I said, “I didn’t say anything about it.” “Why!?” “I didn’t think about it.” “Well you scared me to death, you know.”


Interviewer: Oh, I bet those people told about that for days.


L.G.: They do. Even now they tell about it. They tell about a lot of things that happened. I went to Robinsville one time and the bridge had washed off and [inaudible]. I would had to have gone way down to cross the river to get up to that house and the man had a white horse out there and he said, “Lula, I’ll just send this horse across to you. You ride it back over.” I said, “Well, okay.” I said, “But [inaudible].” He said, “I’ll wade over and bring you back.” So he was going further down where it wasn’t so deep and I got on the horse and went over. And the horse jumped to get up the bank and I just slid off his back right into the middle of the creek. [Laughter] And I had to go to that woman and all she had was a long old dress. I tell ya, it had [in audible] sleeves that come down with the ruffles on it and a long skirt with the ruffle on it. I had to put that on while I delivered the baby and my clothes dried. [Laughter]


Interviewer: I bet she died when she saw you coming up the road. [Laughter]


L.G.: Oh. [Laughter] Oh my goodness. I just couldn't stay on there. I was bareback and it was just straight up. I just kept sliding back. It's a wonder the thing didn't kick me when I fell in the creek. [Laughter]  [inaudible] hadn't gone over to get my pack yet. He was scared to death. [inaudible] me not get hurt. It was just waist deep. I said I came on over to the house.[in audible] Oh, we laughed about that so many times.


Interviewer: Oh gosh. You have been busy..[in audible]. I am surprised you survived. Boy, they really made you work for your pay.


L.G.: Yeah. Yeah. The first two years I worked I just, you know, did it on my own. I was always calling the doctor and ask him what to do. Never did it on my own exactly. I would get the doctor's advice and if I thought he needed to come, I'd call him.


Interviewer: Oh wow. That's really something. [inaudible]


L.G.: I had so many funny things happen.


Interviewer: How's Mark doing?


L.G.: Huh?


Interviewer: How's Mark doing? Have you heard from him?


L.G.: Yeah. [audio cuts off 16:50-17:28] he didn't take that time. So, I guess, it was just about eight months that he stayed out there. I came home, came home, and then I got a letter from him, a notice from him saying he was out and that he- he had a home in San Diego. And he had a [inaudible], I knew he had a, a farm there, a , a farm. A lemon farm and a chicken farm but he had an old couple living on. And so that's where we were going to go. But we didn't get out there.


Interviewer: Did he come here?


L.G.: Mmhm.


Interviewer: Oh.


L.G.: He came. He came here. He was to meet me in Oklahoma City. Oh, you get tired of it. But. When I was on the train and going to Oklahoma City. I was on the train in, uh, Shawnee, and a girl got on and she, we sat there a while, and finally she said, "what tribe are you?". And I said, "I'm an Eastern Cherokee." And she said, "I'm Indian too, but," she said,  "I don't know what tribe." She said, "my grandma never [became (?) ] Indian, she didn't want to be Indian. Said she would [inaudible] and she never would tell us. I know she is from one of the Carolina's", she said. And I said, "what's your", not thinking,  just to make some conversation, I said, well, I said, "what is your grandma's name. What's her name?"  I said, "Maybe if she is from Cherokee, I know." Said her name was Harris. She was, her last name was Harris. She was Harris. And I said, "well my mother was a [inaudible] she belonged to the Harris, she was a Harris.  There was a Betsy, Nancy, and Susanna." She said, "my grandmother's name was Nancy", she said.


Interviewer: Oh no.


L.G.: Nancy Harris. Her maiden name. Well, I said, "I had an aunt, she ran away from home. She eloped. She married a fellow by the name of Brandy. And she moved and last they heard from her, well not last, then they heard from her she was living in Cannon(?), Texas."


She said, "well my grandmama lived in Cannon Texas and she married a Brady". And, I said, "well, Brady died. But she is not a Brady now."


"Yes, but," she said, "well, did your aunt have any children?"


I said, "Yes, she had two children. She had a boy by the name of Henry[Harry?]and a girl by the name of Lily."


She said, "Lily was my mother."


Interviewer: Oh boy.


L.G: After all those years, you know, Aunt Nancy had just run away from home when she was a girl. And I said, "well, one other thing" . I said,  "she is married to a Starky(sp?) now."


 She said, "that's my grandmother."


Interviewer: Oh, wow.


L.G.: And she said, "where are you going?"


I said, "I'm going to California. I'm into Arizona. And maybe on to California,"  I said. She said, "you are going  down with  me to [Bradley?],  Oklahoma before you go on. And I said,  "well, I don't know I will have to see I am meeting my husband in Oklahoma City, we decided that was half way and he was going to meet me there."


 And so when I got there I went to the telephone, telegraph office and he said he'd be four days late. Unavoidable, he said, he'd be four days late. He said, he made reservations at the [Skyward?] Hotel for ya. So I went and sure enough they'd had the reservation. She said, "he's not coming for four days." She said, "lets' just put your things up and go on down to,  just go on down to grandmas."  I said, "well, if she never wanted to be an Indian I don't think she'd want to see me." I said. She said, "anyway we are going." She said,  "I'm getting tired of people laughing at me when I say I'm Indian  and I can't prove it." [laughter]


So, we went down and Aunt Nancy was glad to see me. Glad to know the news of all her folks back here and so and then we went, the next day we went out to [inaudible], where Lily and her family lived. Married a Ballard. Found out that, I mean, I went to church with them and she introduced me as her cousin, her first cousin. And she said now you always made fun of me for saying I'm an Indian, you can't do that anymore. My grandmother and her grandmother are sisters. [laughter]


So then they, Nancy begged me, begged me to, she was sick, and begged me to stay with her.  Since I was a nurse. I stayed with her for 3 months. and that left Jack footloose, he came on through Oklahoma City and then came on down to Bradley then he stayed in Bradley for a few days and he got restless. He said, I'm going back to Oklahoma City. He said, "I'm just fooling around [inaudible] before you get ready to go." And he said. She promised that night, said, I could stay with her. She knew she was going to die. But you know, she knew she could last long, she was old and.


So he went back there, he went to Oklahoma City. And in two or three days he got a job. He was an expert accountant. He worked for the [...Wilson] packing company, meat packing company. he had a good job. He worked there during the day and at night he acted as shipping clerk. So  he held down two jobs and was doing well. By the time my Aunt Nancy die, when she died she left me her home and her land. And, and the people made such a fuss about it. I told them to keep it. I didn't want it. And then we, he, we never did get through Arizona. We came on back here.


Interviewer: He just gave up his job and came here?


L.G.: Gave up his job and came back.


He got, he took over a store here for a man. Took over the [Stern?] Post Office work through that. We've been here ever since.


Interviewer: Did you live here?


L.G.: Mmhmm.


Interviewer: In this house.


L.G.: Not this house. [inaudible] We had planned this. We were going to tear the old house down, it belonged to my aunt and uncle. The old place did. And we, after they gave it up, i said let us have it. We bought the land. and we planned this house, and, and, just got ready to have a man come in tear the old house down and build it. We built a cabin on the hill to live in while they were building the new home. And he died. He had jaundice. they said it was hepatitis but it wasn't an ordinary hepatitis. The man came from Washington. They said [inaudible] there was blood. They said he had a disease that traveled in the far east, that they never had it anywhere but the far east. They wanted to know if he had ever lived anywhere in the far east. When he was a boy he had lived in Egypt.


Interviewer: Mmm.


L.G.: For a long time, I mean, until he was almost grown. With his older brother. And that is what he developed. They said it had laid dormant all those years. Until he got sick, um, some weeks back had gone.


Interviewer: Yeah.


L.G.: And he wasn't sick. He just got weaker and weaker and weaker. And when he died the undertaker said he didn't have a drop of red blood in his body. It was all just yellow syrup.  


Interview: Oh , that -




L.G.: And then I took the insurance money and I made up his house. Stayed there. We had four  children. Thirteen years


Interviewer: Well,  that is pretty good.


L.G.: Yea. [silence] Well, am I telling you what you want to here?


Interviewer: Yea. it's all so interesting


L.G.: The work. Not much to tell expect I went around taking care of people.


Interviewer: Um. Did the doctor that was at the school, he just stay associated with the school, did he moved into the..


L.G.: He didn't make home calls. You know. After. They made changes. And after that they had a doctor who would make calls.


Interviewer: Is that that Dr Holt, that people talked about?


L.G.: Dr. Holt. Dr. Holt would make home calls. He was really  good. Yep. There was a Dr. Oberlander [sp?] with our first-  I wish I had hat old picture, now I've took it home. I had an old picture with all the old school employees when it was a Quaker school. And Dr. Holt, Dr. Oberlander  was there, was a doctor there. And they then they had other, Dr. Holt was there for years and then went away and finally came back again. He was, he was really good to the people. He made calls. I worked with him a lot.


Interviewer: Everybody seems to remember him and really liked him.


 But, did they have some more come in while he was gone? Or, it seems like, for a while, from what I understand, there was just a lot coming through.


L.G.: Came and left, came and left. School doctors. Dr. Minger. I can't remember all of them.


Interviewer: It seems like there was a whole mess of them


L.G.: Dr Holt. Dr. Holt. Dr Waller. We had a Dr. Waller from Washington. He lived in Washington. Dr Holt. Dr Waller. Dr Minger. Dr Pajam [sp?].


Interviewer: [mmhmm] He is the one that married that nurse up there.


L.G.: Mrs. Bretch [sp?]. He was a, Mr Bretch, [inaudible] professional ball player. They were separated. Yeah. You know as much about that as I do.


Interviewer: I know just bare bones of it. but she stayed up, she was just, like, the hospital nurse? right? She was..




L.G.: But, nursing profession has changed so much, since.


Interviewer: Yeah.


L.G.: I don't know why they want to be hired. Or why they have to go to school. They go to school and just spend a few hours with patients. And when they should spend all day with patients and a few hours at school. I mean, they would make better nurses.


Interviewer: Some nurses when they get out, from what I understand, never see patients. They just take care of records, I guess.


LG: I was up there, at the hospital and Gregory [inaudible] came in.  She had been working up there, and the doctor told me she didn't know anything. She didn't know anything. Well, I was sitting in the hall waiting, and they brought a patient in who had had an abortion. And she had been bleeding, and they put her on the table there. And, in the mean time, an accident case  came in. And the doctor had to leave that patient to go, to check on the accident case. And he told this nurse, he said, "drape her for me". He said, "drape her, fix her, get her ready for me to examine her." This nurse and she went and got a sheet and just spread it over her. And she sat at the table in the hall and just. And this woman in there was groaning. And I just couldn't sit there any longer so I got up and went to the door and I saw that she was bleeding bad. So I looked around and saw the stirrups there. I got the stirrups and put them up and put her up in stirrups and draped her. You know, like you drape them for examination. And so she, her pain stopped for a little while. I cleaned her up. I put clean pads on and cleaned her up. And when the doctor came in and went in and saw her, he said,  "My goodness, we have got a nurse here, at last", he said. He thought that the nurse had fixed her. He said, "thank you for fixing her for me", he said. "We have got good help here at last."  Something like that.


She said, "I didn't do it. I didn't fix her." He said, "well, who did?" Said, "somebody fixed her who knew how to do it."  She said, "Mrs. Goyne did it."


And Mrs. Goyne, he said, who is Mrs. Goyne. He was [inaudible] and she said. Pointed at me. He said, "are you a nurse?" I said, "oh, I used to be." And he said, "well, [inaudible] they just don't know how to drape a patient. Don't know how to do anything. Half of them don't.", he said.


Well, some did, I guess. They aren't all bad.


Interviewer: No. But it's changed, an awful lot. How long did, when did you stop doing field nurse?


L.G.: Oh, a long time. After my husband died, I asked for a transfer and I got, I went to Oklahoma. And I lived over about there about nine years.


Interviewer: Oh.


L.G.: After I got out, after we went to Oklahoma. I nurse, did public health work in Oklahoma for, until we moved back here.


Interviewer: Did you do it when you got, came back here? Did you take it back up when you came back here?


L.G.: Uh huh. I didn't want to. [laughter]  Jack didn't want me to work. But they kept coming. They knew.


We got here one day and the next morning there's a man out there, said [inaudible] "my wife is in labor". He said, the doctor and nurse were there all night. They left and said she wasn't ready to deliver. He said, she's got hard pains; she lived below here. They told me you came home last night, so I decided I'd come and get you.


 I said, well you better go call the doctor back, he just left. He said, she wasn't ready to deliver. I went down there and delivered the baby before the doctor came back. [laughter]


 It just started for then on.


Interviewer: Mmhmm. Oh, boy.


L.G.: I was the first public health nurse of the nurses at the hospital.


Interview: That came later?  That come later when, the public health part?


L.G.: mm. They just, they just, um, they never had it here until after, you know, until after they opened it for me


Interviewer: uh huh


L.G.: My birdie.


Interviewer: He is so pretty.


L.G.: He likes that[inaudible]


Interviewer: This one here? He is going to go with this one?


L.G.: I'm making it for the senior citizens, they sell them.


Interviewer: Uh huh, I've seen those up there. He's so pretty. I saw an old cardinal.


L.G.: It's a cardinal.


Interviewer: With the dogwoods.


L.G.: Uh huh. Well, I. There is a woman up there that cuts them up and puts them on but I changed, I changed it some. I wanted to put [claws?] done there but I didn't do it. I thought there's  no use in changing what she. She planned it and. I give it to her and she fits it. And they sell them for 8 dollars. Make money for the senior citizens.


Interviewer: That's a nice center they got down there.


L.G.: mm


Interviewer: That's a nice center they got down there. Nice place.


Interviewer & L.G.: [inaudible]


L.G.: Where are you located?


Interviewer: What here?


L.G.: Uh huh?


Interviewer: Oh,  I sort of work in and out of the hospital.


L.G.: Up here?


Interviewer: Uh huh.


L.G.: [inaudible] About to forget. [laughter] No, I keep hearing a lot of the nurses are about to leave, up there. That true?


Interviewer: I don't know. um


 L.G.: Two nurses I know growing up. We, uh, [inaudible] I sent the girls out and I told them exactly where to go and what to do. It was,[inaudible] it was bath day. They gave them baths. Two of them worked together. And, so, we got a long just fine. We took, we, oh I don't know how many,  I think there were about twelve people with bed sores on them, just getting bigger and bigger. And they were diabetics, I guess. And we made them go to the hospital for treatments and dress the sores. And they had been to a doctor and the doctor say wash it off. just wash it off, gave them a solution. then wash it off every day. well, you can't wash a sore off every day. I know from experience. I know the old doctors would say dress a sore, give it time to heal. boy, Can't do it on the third day or forth day. Because when you wash a sore off every day, you wash off the new [growth?]   and  [inaudible]  , and your sore just gets bigger and bigger.


Interviewer: Oh, yeah.


L.G.: You don't give the skin time to form because you're constantly washing it off. But they don't think of that.  And I know, I know we cured quite a few of them. I mean, they got well.


Interviewer: Yeah.


L.G.: We taught them how to take care of themselves. They, just, were made to think that they sore would never get well. One man had a sore on his leg for  twenty-five years and got well. And died of a heart attack, later on. [laughter] He shot it. He set his shot gun down and shot the top/cap of his leg.


Interviewer: Uh huh.


L.G: And he had that sore for twenty-five years, he told me, when I found him. Oh, it was just rotten. And uh, I went down and started dressing him. And I said, "you go to the hospital?"  He said," no, every time I go to the hospital", he said, "they want to take my leg off."


Interviewer: Mmm.


L.G.: I said, "well there is nothing wrong with the bone, I don't think they'd take your leg off." "Everywhere", he said, "[Booter?] Veterans' Hospital want to take off my leg. No, I want to keep my leg", he said.


So, I tended to it and I noticed that right away that  new circulation started around the edges. And I was rather much encouraged. I kept at it and it had healed in about that much.


Interviewer: Hmm


LG: And, I said, you outta go to the hospital. I said, they can take skin off of your leg and put it on there and it'll heal. It'll get well quicker. He couldn't believe it at first but finally he got so he believed me. and so one day here he came to the hospital up there. And they gave him bandage and dressing like they just been given him and told him to go and take care of it. "No, I'm not going home", he said, "I stay." And they say, no you take care of it at home. "No, I stay", he said,  "Lula said, I stay. I stay." [laughter] They just hate me for that.


Interviewer: [Laughter]


L.G: And he stayed and his sore got well.


Interviewer and L.G.: [inaudible]


L.G.: And he got to go home and ,you know, got a long. And enjoyed a few years of life without that sore, after twenty-five years.


Interviewer: Mmhmm. Gosh, that's [wonderful?].


L.G.: We had some big [inaudible] that after a little attention it healed right up. And then we gave bed baths. And we, I saw, that they took their laundry to the laundry and washed there. I had sheets, we furnished sheets and pillowcases for them.


Interviewer: Mmhmm


For the terminal cases. Quite a few old people who'd been sick a long time. Tuberculosis and I don't know what all. And we did a lot of work. They don't do that anymore.


Interviewer: They don't have that program any more, do they?


L.G.: No.


Interviewer: I didn't think so.


L.G.: No, it's, um, they divided that up into other programs.


Interviewer: Oh.


L.G.: They have the, uh, Charlotte Taylor [inaudible].


Interviewer: No, the CHR program?


L.G.: The CHR program. Is part,  was part of that.




And the CHR, uh, oh. Ed Taylor had a program. There quite a few other programs along with that. But mine was the home visiting. And after going around and seeing people and finding out what the health programs are doing, they have so many health programs. And I found out those were the ones that were neglected and those were the ones we took care of.


Interviewer: Mmhmm


L.G.: We. The girls were real good. Leah[?]. I always had trouble with Leah. She always wanted to do. That's what, I don't get that. No, I said, you do what I tell you to do. Well we could do.. no, you can't. You'll do what I want you to do. And, and, that's what should happen up here.


Interviewer: Mmhmm. You need that strong leadership


L.G.: Strong leadership. They sit and crotchet and read and I seen them up there. And sewing and knitting and doing something instead of waiting on the patients. I don't know if it happens all the time. But I know when I was in the hospital, that's what they did. And some of the programs now, that, that are supposed to make home visits, I see them sitting up at the Senior Center there, crocheting, embroidery, and knitting and doing something for themselves all day long. They don't even go out like they should.


Interviewer: Mmm. They should. If you get out to people and you talk to them and you find out what going on you can do something. if you don't know what's going on, nothing's going to happen.


L.G.: I know. and Gladys was good. They didn't like her. Gladys Griffin. I don't know whether you know her or not.


Interviewer: No.


L.G.: She was up there. She had charge and she told them they were being paid to work and do things, not sit and, and read or crochet. And they just fought her tooth and nail, because she bossed them.


Interviewer: Hm.


L.G.: She was hard on them because she wanted them to do their work, instead of a idling their time away.


Interviewer: Mmhmm


L.G.: And that's the way with so many of these programs, they don't, they don't make them do it.


Interviewer: Yeah. It's like the goals are being lost. Forgetting what the goals are.


L.G.: I know.


Interviewer: It's like that all over health care though. You know, people talk about money all the time now. And about [obtaining?] costs. 


L.G.: Money, money, money.


Interviewer: And so many people just lost sight of the, the patients.


L.G.: And the doctors they, [inaudible] their at fault too they don't. they should try to do more than they do, people thing. But if you know their public health doctors you can, you can know why they don't go all out for doctoring because public health, public health is to teach people to correct diseases. Prevent getting sick. Prevention. They teach prevention. And after you get sick, when you are sick, you don't go to a, uh, public health hospital, you go to a general health hospital. But people don't understand that


Interviewer: Yeah.


L.G.: If you understand that, you, you know why they don't treat them up here. When Dr. Johnson was here, he did all of his surgeries up here. Appendix. And, and amputations. Or whatever needed, he, he did it. He was a good doctor. He, next to Dr. Holt, he was one of the best. And, but it could be that way now. But they're not allowed to do it because they're public health. If you know the difference public health and general hospital they've, uh, been trained and, uh. [Inaudible] us. you understand. I understand why they send them away all the time. They, but they could do more for them, if they would.


Interviewer: Well if this is going to be their primary source of health care, then maybe they should think about that. Or at least, work harder to teach people what this is.


L.G.: Teach people, well, it's to teach [pretatives?].  You know that. 


Interviewer: Yeah.


L.G.:  So few people think about it. I mean, [inaudible] that way.


Interviewer: Well that's, that's kind of the fault of the people up here too.


L.G.: That's a point, a point you could bring. If it was a general hospital, we'd be better off. Because they could do surgery then and then they could give, do other  treatments. Or have real doctors come in and do. But the doctors that come are doctors who are obligated to the government for paying their scholarship.


Interviewer: Yeah.


L.G.: For their training. And they come and they just want, idle with time most of the time. I mean, until their two years are up and then they can go and practice for their selves. There's so many sides to a question, to a thing like that.


Interviewer: Yeah, and that


L.G.: That you don't think about. When you think about it, it's a, it's a big puzzle.


Interviewer: If it is a public health hospital and that's what it is right now, then they should be, they should be stressing teaching, stressing prevention. Really hitting it hard. Which they don't.


L.G.: yeah. They should be teaching prevention all the way. Keeping them from getting sick. And after they get sick, they, they're no longer for the public health hospital. They go to a general hospital.


Interviewer: Mmhmm. There is.


L.G.: But so few people know that.


Interviewer: That's something that I just learned recently, very recently.


L.G.: Yeah.


Interviewer: And you think hospital, and you just assume that it should be a regular hospital. They need incentives, up there, I think.


L.G.: They need a doctor that can, that does more surgery. One that's not, not, just serving time, as the saying goes. One that's really interested. I think Dr. Treige [sp?] is.


Interviewer: I've heard a lot of people speak really highly of him.


L.G.: He, uh huh. I think he would be real good, if he could. But he is restricted by being in a public health hospital.


Interviewer: Gotta be something that could be done, though.


L.G.: Mm?


Interviewer: There really oughta be something that could be done.


L.G.: Something could be done about it


Interviewer: It's time to..


L.G.: The Indians don't know any, I mean , the council members, they don't know any difference. They don't know. They think a hospital is just a hospital. They don't realize the difference between public health and a just regular hospital.


Interviewer: Mmhmm. Well then is comes down to teaching people, again, what the difference is.


L.G.: [laughter]


Interviewer: Gotta, always gotta go back to teaching people.


L.G.: Go back to teaching.


Interviewer: Uh huh. Never going to finish teaching. Once it's one thing, it'll be something else.


L.G.: General hospital takes care of patients.


Interviewer: Well, they, they run a - They don't prevent at a general hospital. They just wait and  patch people up as they come through.


LG: And one of the doctors in [Br..?] asked the doctors here why they didn't wear white or if [inaudible] doctors. The doctor said, well, I don't know. When I came here, they told me they are going to wear white cause everybody, from the orderlies up wears white. And then.


[recording ends]








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